You’re much further along than I am, or at least on a more interesting tangent. I haven’t seen anything close enough or anomalous enough to make we wonder at the same level as you and many other witnesses. I wish I had, and I still want to.

Hear that, you aliens-or-whatever-you-are?

I still haven’t had any personal experience with UFOs, (except a couple of times with unexplained movements of lights in the nighttime desert sky) but I have a “belief” that something besides us is out there, and the evidence is overwhelming (at least to me.)

In my very first post I explained my general take on UFOs:

The UFO subject is above all, a fun and stimulating intellectual exercise that brings up important scientific and philosophical questions: Are we alone as a species endowed with consciousness? Can we learn something from our non-human friends? Are they just us in another guise? Is the history of humankind intimately connected to something that we have called “gods” “spirits” or even “aliens?” Is this all just wishful thinking by minds hungry for contact or weary of the problems of this world? I think the answer is a combination of all of these, and that’s one of the most exciting things we can consider.

You wrote:

You know belief is a tricky word. Some things I have to believe in, because logic will allow no alternative.

If belief is a tricky word, how do you define things that you “have to believe” in? It seems like logic and belief are mutually exclusive terms (unless after a logical process, you’re putting something that can’t be explained yet in the “belief” file, to have somewhere to put it while things are figured out.)

Toasters are an item almost everyone knows about. UFOs, I would argue, are quite different. It seems like a spurious comparison, or I’m not understanding you correctly.

I also don’t see how a belief in UFOs could burn you, other than if you hold to one category of belief only to find yourself defending it when it doesn’t fit a chosen, narrow definition. Belief requires no proof, or at least a willful ignorance of contrary information.

What “path” have I chosen that is different from yours? In the post, I tried to explain that I am not in any one category. I shift my perspective depending on the case, the reported facts, the witnesses, my current state of mind, the latest book I’ve read, etc.

You also said

Is it poppycock machinations of over imaginative minds? Or is it something truly strange and unknown or is it something you can reference to another belief system? I tend to chose the latter because I have been forced down that path.

Which latter definition? “truly strange and unknown” or “something you can reference to another belief system”? I agree with both, at one time or another. UFOs are sometimes also the “poppycock machinations of overactive minds.”

I’m not actually sure we disagree about this!

I can’t presume to know exactly what Nick thinks about UFOs, but I’m pretty sure he would generally agree with what I have said here.

I don’t “believe” in a religious sense; I don’t “know” either. but then again, I do. I know very weird things have happened to me. why, what, all those quesitons, I have no idea.

Even if “they” tell me what they are, who they are, why they are, that doesn’t mean I’m going to believe them. “they” could be lying after all.

I do know, based on my experience, and the reading I’ve done over the years, there is, as you said:

“For the individual who knows that there really is something knocking at our collective consciousness, there is no defensive stance needed. It’s not easy to spot this type of person. They generally shut up about it because there is no need to prove anything.”

I agree.

“The experience they have gone through may not even be explainable in words. To try would be folly. Beware of those who say they “know” certain things to be true. They’re most likely lying, at least to themselves.”

I blather on so much on my blog and elsewhere because I don’t know what happened, and I think, somewhere in my head, that by exploring UFO Land I’ll find out. Maybe. Probably not, but it’s fun trying. But I know I don’t know.

Jess

I agree with you 100%. Belief destroys critical thought, which is unfortunate when the subject is as slippery as UFOs.

That’s why I gave myself an out by suggesting that these might be more like categories. I suppose that “knowing” is more in class by itself. Point taken.

Also, my I think that my point on these matters was more metaphysical or psychological than legal or scientific, at least, that’s what I was trying to get across.

It was small, looked like a star or a planet or a satellite or a plane depending on how high (or far away it was). It was just a point of light in the black sky.

It caught my eye because I was looking up at the clear night sky from the high desert of Central Oregon, far from any light pollution, and it was moving against the starry background.

Then, as I watched, it executed a 90 degree turn - without slowing or banking as far as I could see.

It just changed direction. Doesn’t sound like much. It’s just that I don’t know of anything we had in 1978, or have today, which is capable of making such a course change while flying.

So… I know there’s something unexplained out there. I don’t have any opinion as to what it is, or how it can make such a seemingly impossible move.

Thus: I don’t believe in anything relative to this phenomenon I just know that something in the universe can do it.

Because of that event I keep watching the UFO reports and military aircraft developments hoping that someone will post an explanation which makes sense (I know: “bit of a dreamer, bit of a fool”).

No belief… A lot of interest driven by the certain knowledge that I don’t KNOW!