Maybe his disdain for ufology, shared at one time or another by most people in it, stemmed from an understandable contempt for that kind of small mindedness.

Keel’s observation about the human lack of sensory equipment was almost word for word once said to me also by Tim Leary.

The problem with that interview was my failure to challenge him on certain assertions. I doubt if he would have contradicted anything he said, but the conversation certainly would have gone down some more enlightening paths.

I’ll send a separate e-mail with my documentation of Arnold’s Constablerian view of UFOs. Everyone here will have to wait until next spring when the new Maury Island book, entitled JFK & UFO, will be out from Feral House.

Fair enough. I know you’re a fan of Keel’s, and we’ll just have to agree to disagree on this one. I think the work of people like Clark and Hall will live on, because it’s based on evidence - the work of Keel will be forgotten by all but a few in a short period of time, I think.

Paul

I think that Keel was well aware of those cases, but chose to ignore them as inimical to his ideas and theories. He didn’t care if the UFO subject gained any respectability, he was on his own trip.

I find it surprising that you say he wasn’t interested in any serious research. He worked for decades intensely researching his ideas by talking to witnesses, visiting locations, and compiling data. Because this didn’t add to the mainstream UFO database shouldn’t be cause to dismiss his work.

Your comment about “making myths” may be a key here. He may have been ufology’s trickster, showing where too much seriousness for too long in one direction was damaging to a full understanding of the phenomenon and its connections to other paranormal events and issues.

Humans are analytical and emotional creatures. UFOs and whatever causes them appear to tap into both sides of this dichotomy. It may be the ultimate Rorschach blot. This issue was (and is) routinely ignored by the “serious” researchers.

I recall that Vallee included a space for psychological and emotional effects on witnesses in his matrix of UFO experience categories, acknowledging this aspect of the UFO subject. For those interested in a respectable face of ufology who played the P.R. game and knows how to get a complex idea across in an intelligent way, there is no better representative than Vallee, in my opinion, since Hynek has long ago left us.

Keel’s ideas were revolutionary and relevant, and still are. I think that he will be respected in much the same way that some artists, writers. and other creative types have gained fame after their deaths when the world catches up with their thinking.

Those quotes bothered me as well, but see my response to Kenn as well as Paul below.

I think that Keel had a dim view of most of ufology because they had a similar view of him. He brought it on and reveled in it.

Your interview points up the seamy side of this dysfunctional relationship, and reveals Keel, warts and all, as a controversial figure with something important to say. That’s why he remained a vital and interesting figure until his death, and continues to be.

When is the new edition of your Maury Island book coming out? I’d really like to read about Arnold’s change from technological to a more biological view of UFOs. Never heard of that!

I thought that Bannister picked up something that had been cobbled together from readily available radio and other electronics parts, and not really a “saucer.” As I recall from your book, it sounded like some sort of hoax or possibly a breaching experiment or counterintel thing.

I mean, I would have loved if someone would have mentioned the Socorro case or Jacques Vallee during the interview, but I fear that would have turned things pretty ugly.

Also, I wasn’t quick enough on the draw to point out that the Fugo baloons went up a good two years before Roswell and were not likely to remain aloft that long. Although I will say that the Fugo theory was also put forth by infamous FBI agent/Oswald employer Guy Bannister in testimony before the Lousiana HUAC. Banister was present in the Pacific northwest during the first post-Arnold wave and even helped recover a small saucer.

Arnold’s view of what he saw actually came to resemble more Trevor James Constable’s idea of living transdimensional beings. More on that in my upcoming new edition of the Maury Island book.

Keel was thrown a little bit that Bonds even had an interest in reprinting Mothman. In the interview he talks about how small the interest in UFOs/paranormalism had become, when in fact this was at a time of great resurgence of interest (X Files, etc.) Also I think he thought he was talking to some mainstream journalist types, not fellow denizens of the fortean underground. Anyway, he was self-consciously touching controversy buttons. The interview may not have been Keel at his best but I’m glad I helped rescue it from archival obscurity. Thanks to you, Greg, for airing it.